General attitude of Anjuna fans

[mrman]

Having browsed through a lot of the Anjuna fan pages on FB, this forum, and the A&B Subreddit, I've found myself a little bewildered by the 'attitude' of a lot of Anjunafans.

I'll preface by saying I'm no Anjuna elitist about the old school trance sound, though I won't lie and say that I've found a lot of newer releases to be hit and miss.

In light of this, it seems that the sentiments of a lot of fans outside of the more 'serious' forums, such as this forum, is that the Anjuna 2.0 sound is fantastic, and that although we all can appreciate and respect the old trance sound, the sound of Anjuna/A&B has grown to be all about living in the moment/the feels/family/feeling united etc. And I agree, I love these aspects of going to Anjuna shows. But I almost feel like there's not much room to be critical anymore, or room to say, "I don't like this track; it sounds generic", or "I don't think artist X is really putting in his best effort with this". 

I've only recently found this forum, but reading through all the discussion on here about particular tracks, and the variety in A&B's set sort of took a weight off my chest. In the FB Anjuna [family] pages, and to a lesser extent on the subreddit, I feel like I'm not allowed to critique their sets/tracks without being labelled another one of those 'old school Anjuna' negative types. 

Anyways this post is not meant to be another one of the typical 'How has the Anjuna/A&B sound evolved/changed' discussions which I've grown everso tired of discussing, but a discussion about the attitude of fans. Apologies if the general tone of this post comes off as a little negative (it wasn't intended as so)  .

[jaja2k]

Some time ago, negativity was almost the norm (in the official anjunaforum at least). Now it is a bit more mixed, but still people are much more critical here than in FB.
As long as criticism is constructive, I personally don't see any problem.

[theboz]

Totally agree with you. While I wasn't around for it, the old forum was filled with hate during the 2.0 transition years and I think it made a lot of people get super defensive. I think it's because for a lot of new fans who haven't discovered the back catalog, they don't realize how valid some of the concerns might be. And when compared to other basic EDM, Anjuna really is miles ahead, making stuff like Anybody seem like Nimbuses in their eyes. Like said above though, as long as it's constructive criticism then who cares?

[svenmo]

Yeah, it seems that negativity waxes and wanes from season to season. Last spring, the boards were pretty negative, but starting with WW06, the general vibe has been pretty positive. And it seems that GT200 made almost everyone a believer that anjuna was headed "in the right direction." There's certainly always room for constructive criticism and dissent though. Without it, what's the point in praise?

[theboz]

Nov 14, 2016 2:50:27 GMT svenmo said:

Yeah, it seems that negativity waxes and wanes from season to season. Last spring, the boards were pretty negative, but starting with WW06, the general vibe has been pretty positive. And it seems that GT200 made almost everyone a believer that anjuna was headed "in the right direction."

Same thing happened with 150 too. Instead of trickle feeding us releases from landmarks, they released them all in close succession, which leads us to that lull in high quality content during the spring time and early summer.

[philipandtigger]

The A&B Facebook page has always a bit of an embarrassment, in my opinion. Full of superficiality and the banal "OMG we LOVE you, come to Massachusetts" type of affair, but that's popular social media and electronic music for you.

Reddit also, despite being a dog's breakfast to use, has the potential to flower into a place where any informed criticism gets drowned out by fanatical happy clapping.

For me, criticism is perfectly valid if it is qualified - if you eloquently explain why you don't like a track, without resorting to mindless slagging and the unqualified "this track is sh_t" type of post. It's what makes discussing music interesting, if we all had the same opinion and agreed about everything there'd be no point talking about it.

Anyway, despite the claim otherwise, I really do believe that, ultimately, Reddit was selected by Anjuna as a "forum replacement" precisely because any criticism or negative opinion can be drowned out - they don't want to hear it. The old Anjunaforum was largely neglected after Jono threw his toys out of the pram and posted his own rant about the state of play on there, a lot of what he said was pointed and justified - but why bother taking the time to post this at all? Clearly, some of what was posted on there touched a nerve - when you're receiving millions of Facebook likes and single sentence gushing praise, sprinkled with emoticons, every time you break wind or make a cup of tea - when anyone has any sort of negative opinion about the label (however qualified) it's going to "hurt" all the more...

[philipandtigger]

PS - Freedom of speech and expression (within reason) is encouraged around these parts

[Deleted]

That's the reason I like this Forum more than the old one. This one is unofficial and isn't related to Anjuna in any way, so they can't restrict our discussions, they can't control the "overwhelming negativity". Also I agree on all the points made about Facebook and Reddit - those places are just fanatic, there's no constructive criticism to be found.

[mrman]

Nov 14, 2016 6:51:05 GMT @april said:

That's the reason I like this Forum more than the old one. This one is unofficial and isn't related to Anjuna in any way, so they can't restrict our discussions, they can't control the "overwhelming negativity". Also I agree on all the points made about Facebook and Reddit - those places are just fanatic, there's no constructive criticism to be found.

There are definitely people who are open to critical discussion on the subreddit and FB fan groups, but I've found that they only really come out and talk when someone else prompts the discussion. Otherwise, it really is just a lot of over the top fanboyism.

[dspencer124]

I think sites like FB/reddit, where it's really hard to read anything longer than a couple of lines, lead to comments of 'OMG I love it' or 'OMG I hate it'...there's no room for nuance and, when you have hundreds (if not thousands of comments), how do you find the one salient post on a topic that you'd like to read in the majority? I always loved the Anjunaforum, and by extension this new outlet, because it allows people to express detailed opinions and have a proper discussion about topics.

And yes, the forums can occasionally be a bit negative but as long as any criticism is well explained then I don't think anyone has any problems with that (or they shouldn't). And, if a tune is rubbish, then what does any label gain by non-critical feedback? As soon as one only listens to positive feedback (or self-reinforcing views), then that's where problems lie...

[maxirobriguez]

I think the main issue in regards to Anjuna disappointment was that A&B hit a major lull. WAAWN is frankly a forgettable album - Sticky Fingers is the black stain of any A&B release and tunes like Blue Sky Action, Hello and All Over the World just complete the sea of mediocrity that is the middle section of the album.

When you look at Group Therapy and you pick out Thing Called Love, Sun & Moon, On My Way to Heaven (the club mix anyway) - banger after banger. Even Filmic and Alchemy are instant classics. It's a top quality album and it was surrounded by Tri-State which was equally as good, an acoustic album which was fantastic and of course OceanLab. Maintaining that level of production is difficult, and it makes WAAWN just look useless because we're used to high quality work.

That said - Sink the Lighthouse at ABGT200 was one of my favourites of the night and a nice twist on the original and Beautiful Together was great, so there's hope still. Not to mention the Prydz v System F mashup and the 2016 version of Amsterdam which, imo, better than Smith & Pledger remix. It seems like A&B might be moving away a bit from the Bayer sound, which is a good thing.

As long as A&B are creating good material, then people won't complain too much about Anjuna in general.

[philipandtigger]

Andrew Bayer's fingerprints were all over a good percentage of Group Therapy (which you praise), however?

[theboz]

Nov 15, 2016 17:36:52 GMT philipandtigger said:

Andrew Bayer's fingerprints were all over a good percentage of Group Therapy (which you praise), however?

IIRC, Bayer only helped with two songs on Group Therapy according to the CD booklet.

[philipandtigger]

No, that's not correct.

He received writing credits for two Group Therapy tracks (Black Room Boy and Love is Not Enough), but his production and engineering fingerprints are more or less over the whole album. He played a greater role with WAAWN, as he was involved from the get-go, but when he came on board for Group Therapy most of the tracks were already written...

Tony McGuinness: "We produce most of the music ourselves. We have done a lot of the work on this album (Group Therapy) with Andrew Bayer who has been a colleague of ours for some time." (October 2011)

[anthropology]

I know he was also in the production process somewhere with Sun & Moon

[commerce]

I always felt on the old forum that artists/mods whatever always turned up when the negativity was in full flow, but were nowhere to be seen when it was all sunshine and positive vibes. Whether it was deliberate or not I have no idea but Jono in particular would only ever respond to negative posts. I mean I can understand sticking up for yourself if someone is just being a rude arsehole but I sometimes got the impression we were all being tarred with the same brush, like when your mates start throwing darts at each other in the pub and the barman stares at you disapprovingly as if you're their dad.

I'll freely admit to coming across a bit rude sometimes but I think that's the age old problem of a goofy sense of humour not working too well in written form!

[mikeyfab]

Nov 15, 2016 17:36:52 GMT philipandtigger said:

Andrew Bayer's fingerprints were all over a good percentage of Group Therapy (which you praise), however?

bayer's sound became a bit too prevalent in WAAWN. he felt a lot more like a 4th producer on that album. i feel that his touches are a bit more subtle in group therapy, and that he was helping only to a certain extent, albeit it is more obvious in some tracks. i agree with that post, i'm glad that A&B are moving away from the bayer sound. it feels like they've submitted their whole identity to him in the past few years (cough cough AI cough), but the new ID and balaeric balls both feel much more organically A&B than many of their most recent works. 


also, re: commerce (not sure how to quote multiple posts in one response on here), i definitely have to agree about the whole being painted with a broad brush by artists who visited the old forum. producers most certainly only turned up in the forum when negativity was peaking and not any other time, and it was really unfair when we were all being labeled as ungrateful fans. meanwhile, trying to have a sensible talk with jono only resulted in bs, face value answers that consisted entirely of beating around the bush and avoiding the true question at hand. im still a bit bitter about that whole thread whenever it's brought up. it feels as if any criticism, even if constructive, was entirely dismissed as bitter ramblings from 'fans who are stuck in the past', when a lot of it was legitimate, whether or not it was worded eloquently. i worry that the echo chamber of facebook, twitter. etc fans (people who claim an ilan bluestone set changed their life) has become too strong amongst the biggest producers on the label these days and they view anything outside of the circlejerk with disdain.



side note: i havent been able to get on the old forum for about a week now (keeps saying my browser is not secure, same as the other times the site was inaccessible). safe to say the old forum is gone for good? either way, i'm very pleased to see how smooth the transition to this platform has been. nearly seamless, and it seems to have renewed a lot of people's interest in coming back to the forum while also retaining many of the regular contributors as well. great job folks

[mrman]

Nov 15, 2016 23:07:01 GMT mikeyfab said:

meanwhile, trying to have a sensible talk with jono only resulted in bs, face value answers that consisted entirely of beating around the bush and avoiding the true question at hand. im still a bit bitter about that whole thread whenever it's brought up. it feels as if any criticism, even if constructive, was entirely dismissed as bitter ramblings from 'fans who are stuck in the past', when a lot of it was legitimate, whether or not it was worded eloquently.

I've seen this forum incident with Jono mentioned many times over, but never really understood what happened (wasn't on the old Anjunaforum). Not to dig up the past, or any negative vibes associated with this incident, but a bit of context would be great.

[philipandtigger]

Jono:

Posted 16 February 2013 - 04:27 PM


Where's Boom Jinx's album?



I really respect Kandi for his rants, you know, but you know even he's now going a bit 2.0. Gone off him - haven't you heard he makes hardcore sometimes? Clearly not pure. Agree.



Super8 + Tab aren't friends with Anjuna anymore as they put a record out on Enhanced. Bet it's Jono who asked them to change. Why won't Anjuna put out a pure trance record, I mean just one once in a I while? Why can't it be 2002 anymore? Remember Anjunabeats Volume 6?



But didn't they meet Paavo at the pub? Need more uplift. Where is Oliver Smith? He's very down to earth. Doesn't even sound like one of his own productions. Fanb0y. Obviously doing it for the money isn't he. Had a great night - Super8 +Tab closed after A&B and were great. I disagree, 2004 was my favourite year. He tried something new and I didn't like it. WTF was he thinking? Not a fan of Kandi. Generic. Money - simples.



Hate that one - sounds like a dutch cat being strangled. Can deal with it being 134 but can't Elo & Janne up the pace next time? I've said it before, Anjunabeats Vol 10 is THE WORST yet - bet I'll be proven right once it's released. Soundprank is a nice guy - I met him at a show and he shook my hand, and he's true to his roots so I'll support him. Rare these days. No one posts on the forum. That is their weakest to date. Why can't it be 2006 anymore? The problem is that kids these days don't even know Binary Finary. Fast losing faith. The evil Anjuna machine tooled him into making that. N2O - I now hate him as he made K.O. What were they thinking?



He's respected. That's EXACTLY what they are doing. Even Jaytech has gone 2.0 for this release - I hope he goes back for his next release. Where's the melody? That's not evolution, that's the same as what I heard in 2003. Robots, not humans. Norin & Fad? It's sold its soul. Tape-stop. Paavo said something on the forum once - I'll search out the post in a sec. No one likes them. Talk about riding the bandwagon. Evolution is acceptable when I say so. Well, in the way that I decide. +1000. It's just not what their label should be about. I can't believe you actually believe them. I have to say Ronski's new on sounds amazing - the only track I actually like on the album, which is a shame. They've gone down the drain now. Seeing him next week at Beta and Denver so I'll try and ask his views on 2.0. I don't agree that it's art. No one is forcing you to listen to it. Ever since he joined the label it's changed.



Name says it all. The problem I have with it is that it obviously never fitted in the first place, so why put it in at all? 2.0 is so formulaic. I hope one day they do return to what they were doing before what it is that they are doing now - that's what I think they should be doing, not what they are actually doing now. Fart. You lot have scared them away. Hate it. The problem with 1.0 was that producers got bored of it - it was too formulaic. Opinions are like arseholes. It's too early to tell. The problem is they didn't evolve, but one day they just woke up and switched - that is what is unacceptable behaviour and what many are so angry about. You're an arsehole. They've changed. It's made for clubs only and not to listen to. People like Nitrous Oxide said as much. Bet Anjuna are asking him to make it more house and that's why it's taking so long to release the album. Are Super8 and Tab gay? Definitely the peak. Mat Zo? I don't mind that they did it, but they should have told us they were doing it first. Forum search!



At least Jody Wisternoff said it right. Armada only signed it cos Anjuna didn't want it. At least when Tiesto went house he said he was going house - I respect him for saying that. That's not house, it's bro-step. Pics or STFU! All their stuff sounds the same. Never been so disappointed in my life. It's not that I hate it - some of it is quite good, I am just wondering why they can't make it the same as they did before? It's stopped innovating. If I want coffee I'll go to Starbucks, and if I want a burger I'll go to McDonalds - it's about the brand. Guys - THIS is an example of progressive house… My 9 year old brother could have made that. Call me ignorant. No, Tony did the guitar on that. We all know what EDM really stands for. If you don't like the new sound, then listen to the old stuff - it's still available for you to buy and listen to! Disagree. That is an insult to house music. Why can't they innovate for once? Hopefully the next will sound more like Volume 7 again. Sad but true. It's just a brand these days it seems. I feel the need to voice my opinion. It's 2.0 but it's just about acceptable, considering.



That's not 1.0. Why did they change the piano? I'm telling you guys, Tony's behind the change to 2.0. I didn't NEED to go to their show - I already know. Parker & Hanson do it better. Why is everyone the same? They should leave the label cos it's just not the same. What about the old fans? Hardcore is really hard to produce. The old regulars don't even release anything anymore. I'm not being negative. It's America's fault. Not heard it yet but I don't need to. It's ignorance. They only played Satellite and Home. I've listened to the previews and I've heard enough to know I don't like it. I can't believe I'm saying this but I actually don't dislike the new Mat Zo release! I hate "LA". The worst track here is from Arty. Honestly, I'd like to like something but I just hate everything there. They never play their classics anymore. It's not that I'm against an artist experimenting, but this is plain wrong. Doesn't look that bad but I was hoping for something more. Sounds more full than the dry version I heard last year. Stuff used to flow more. +2. They need to go back to their 2005 sound. I don't see the point of it existing? You know it actually saddens me to hear that. Fleming tells it how it is. Why did they have to put that bass sound in?



The powers that be at Anjuna removed the preview. Ball officially dropped. Will they ever go back to the old sound? White noise. It may be a collab but I can tell Andrew Bayer did all the work - you can hear the same clap sound as in his last release too. It's more forward thinking. The sudden interruption of the 2.0 noises actually causes me physical stress. 2008 FTW. Bet the cash is rolling in to the coffers. Paavo said. I blame Bayer. Sad to say Genix is the most uplifting here. You're judging too early. Even Beckwith is sounding like Oliver Smith. Troll. I only like club trance. #ABGT? Anjuna forced them to change. Wannabe. Too whacky for me. I wanted to hate it but I actually like it now I heard it on a big system. I don't need to hear it out, I just know. I am nice to Jess - I was just asking a question. I'm not angry I just want to see the best for them and the label. Filler track. Their album was a complete let-down. Trouse?! I once had a beer with Paavo in London. This latest track they've produced simply ruins the vision that I had for their career. Having heard the previews today, I can honestly say I'm more excited than I was yesterday. It sucks - confirmed. Here's some constructive criticism for the guys if they're reading. Who is Hardwell? What were they thinking here? I hate Bart Claessen. What happened to the lush pad sound at 3:55 in version in the video from them playing at Creamfields? Anjunadeep 05 is where it's at. Not ONE pre-2005 release. I just don't see what the big deal is. I feel the same way. Generic. But he's never even been to a club so how can he tell? Clap clap! I know what's best for them. /End of story. You're just wrong. #LBGT - pmsl! I wish people who are alive now and listening would have been listening when I was back in the day so they'd understand. I proceeded to stand there with my arms folded, right in front of the DJ booth until the track ended. TL;DR

[philipandtigger]

Posted 16 February 2013 - 11:02 PM

Mike, appreciate your thoughts as ever, and also the general enthusiasm in this forum.



The reason that a lot of this anger and frustration is expressed is perhaps because we have a lot of passionate people who really do care, and that is great. That's actually a wonderful thing. In my opinion this could be channeled/utilised better as I've said many times in the past.



The post was merely a bit of fun - some on-tour musings when I took a quick look at the forum today while eating my omelette, rather than consciously collecting over time. Much of it was of course made up, and little of it made much sense as the psychiatrists amongst you suggested.



People saying what they think certainly doesn't consciously influence what I personally do in the studio, or our direction. Why would any creative person want to do that? The army out there could use its resources better perhaps?



Listening to feedback on the business side is perhaps another matter in some cases, but at the creative end of things any musician/artist/writer will tell you it's not as if you write music to order for your "fans". Inspiration just hits. While you work hard to get a production right sometimes, the stuff you actively force is never as good. I think this is the big misunderstanding that for some reason will maybe never go away.



I can actually relate to it as a listener. I grew up with certain bands, and sometimes wish they'd make an album/record like the ones I knew from my younger years. It's highly likely they won't, however, and I accept that. It doesn't take away from those old records that I love though. Unless they wanted to work with me on something, I certainly wouldn't put effort into being angry about it on their web forum or trying to steer them in another direction, though.



As a creative person who makes things that people consume, I fully accept criticism is going to happen. It's part of the territory. Just don't expect me to heed the advice given. Notice or observe it, yes sometimes.



I put my heart and soul into what I do, but ultimately the first person I produce music for is for me. I have to believe in it. I don't know anyone I respect who is any other way when it comes to writing music.



I could be making 138BPM music next year, but I just don't view things from the perspective of tempo anyway. Music will change. Few of us will be doing the same next year as we were doing last year.



Don't be a Black Room Boy.



Right, back to work here in NYC.

[philipandtigger]

Posted 19 February 2013 - 03:48 AM

Clap away all you like, but who is pushing arguments aside? Denying sometimes because things that are posted here are indeed on occasion factually incorrect - you can have that, yes.



We could quite easily shut the forum down if we wished to, remember.



I was merely delving into a discussion if anything. "Tea with the haters" could have been great fun. I'm not sure it's been done before either.



If anything, simply posting an animated gif of someone clapping is more likely to close the same door you may have wished to keep open....

[philipandtigger]

Posted 19 February 2013 - 04:18 AM

Again, another weak analogy here.



Quite a lot of people played pong, didn't they? Would you want to stop people from playing pong, or not want games like pong to exist for those who wished to enjoy them? I certainly wouldn't, but then I believe in free choice.



Also, a more complex idea does not always trump a simple one in both the artistic world or the "real world". You're making a big leap right there.



It's a case of acceptance. Not everyone agrees with your taste, in the same way that an artist accepts that you don't like their music. Equally if we looked into it, it's quite possible that I may dislike much of the music you like, but you won't find me shouting about that or telling you it's shit.



I suppose the key message is that no amount of discussion on this forum will change anything that we do artistically.



What would I do if I were you? Become a music critic, set up a label, promote a night, or do anything that allows you to properly express that passion, but hey that's just me.



I say all this because I get a sense sometimes that there is this hope that if you shout enough about something then "they'll give in the end". Now to me, that would be selling out.



Your energy might be better used in another way if you want real results.

[philipandtigger]

ME AGAIN NO LONGER QUOTING JG

This is the link I use:

anjunaforum.com/topic/62847-notes-from-a-web-forum/

I use IE, when the security certificate screen pops up - I bypass it

[philipandtigger]

And with regard to Mikeyfab's reference:


mfabs724, on 06 Nov 2015 - 2:33 PM, said:


this is a lame ass justification for your current set trackilsts. "we're too picky to play anything but late 2014/15 anjunabeats records"

stop making excuses, jono (just get up and dance)

Jono:

Not every show, but actually we do throw in the odd oldie sometimes. Sometimes that is fun.

Again, generally I'd rather look forward than back too much. The old material hasn't gone away for anyone to play.

Thanks for directing Tony's lyric against me though

Ok, that's my forum dose for this month. I will surely be back in the future, but I have to be honest it is not the most enjoyable place hence why I rarely visit. I think the reason is because of a lack of understanding. Perhaps it's a communication thing too.

Sorry destroy any illusions, but us artists aren't perfect - we are selfish on many levels and just make and play music that we like. Sometimes that makes a few listeners angry. We are not very service-industry thinking naturally. If we were, I would guess actually some would find what we do more shallow and false, but it's perhaps hard to see that when some supposed fans think they know what they want an artist to do. I've known this dialogue for a good 10 years or so now! It does not change.

It's a strange dynamic, for sure. If we were just doing what people on forums asked then I'd probably be bored shitless making cookie cutter records that I've done before 10 years ago. There's nothing wrong with those in fact, but I have no desire to get out of bed to make a record I've already made yesterday.

What I will say is that if as an artist you constantly doubt and don't follow a core gut feeling / belief then in a sense you will have no values (in the process of attempting to please everyone).

[philipandtigger]

And...

Hunter, on 06 Nov 2015 - 1:37 PM, said:


Jono, thanks for your continued responses. Nice to know your still checking up on us from time to time.

I think you may have misunderstood my point. I put blame on promoters for not putting Bayer & Ilan on the same stage since I believe that stages should be organized by genre.

In your earlier post on this thread you said "perhaps criticism needs to be leveled at the lineup" which I took to mean that you were saying that the promoters signed too many Anjuna artists to the festival which resulted in some track overlap. So that's why I brought up money because not bringing them to the festival would mean less money for Anjunabeats. I'm not accusing you guys of being in it for the money. I know better than that I must have misunderstood what you meant.

In regard to the 43 mishap at 150, I fault ilan completely for that. He only had to fill an hour and he had to have known that you just played the (very nice) bootleg before him.

Also its long been my suspicion that A&B sets are 85% identical night to night due to the custom visuals that are made for certain tracks and thus the guy controlling this kinda needs to know whats about to happen (since I have no idea how lights & visuals & such work) this would also explain why older tracks can't get recycled into today's sets. If anyone has any knowledge/links about how the visuals work at big clubs and festivals I'd appreciated it.

Also, while I've never been to Ibiza I feel like thats one of the places where at their summer residency where only 1 member plays, the set is more likely to have some throwbacks and whoever is djing is more willing to mix it up. That feeling is based off of 1001 tracklists & tweets and such. If the visuals in Ibiza aren't too special then it may lend support to my suspicion.

Jono:

I cannot comment on Andrew and Ilan, however "blame" feels like a strong word. Maybe you should talk to him at a show if you have a real issue reconciling this! He is quite approachable. It's slightly bizarre to me how strongly someone could feel about 2 artists playing 1 record (2 different versions) in night - it's not exactly the end of the world is it.

All of these things you say about Ibiza, visuals etc are pretty much your imagination and trying to join dots though. When I do pop on this forum there is a lot of dot joining, conspiracy, hearsay, speculation and guesswork. All I can say is of course we have visuals for big / successful / popular (whatever word you want to pick) songs that we play. That doesn't drive decisions though, but when we write a new album and put our heart and soul into it, you bet we are going to tour the world playing those tracks just like any other act of the last 60 years or so does. For every one of you, there are 10 fans who would feel short changed if we didn't play a particular track.

[philipandtigger]

And look who started it!

BigBoz, on 06 Nov 2015 - 1:25 PM, said:


Jono I'd still like to hear a real reason from you why you guys don't play a wider variety of music new and old, though. Your festival sets all seem to include 2014 and early-mid 2015 tunes, and the track lists usually appears relatively static. There are sooooo many amazing songs released on Anjuna, or that are going to be released, that you guys don't play. Surely if they're good enough to sign, they're good enough to play? And if they're not, why sign them?
I've seen what Tony has said regarding your festival sets and that you guys just want to play the biggest tracks that everyone knows (paraphrasing on this one), but you guys are one of the biggest names in the industry. People are gonna notice and talk about what you guys play, so why not give them some truly extraordinary things to talk about?

Jono:

Not sure what Tony has said - I can only speak from my own perspective. Festivals are certainly a time to play big records, but equally I personally make an effort to make sure we don't sound like the million EDM guys out there and that we do our own thing. That means playing our own big records rather than searching through the Beatport top 10 and losing our identity like many jobbing festival artists might think to do....

Are you a conspiracy theorist? Well there is no conspiracy. We are not a tribute/legacy artist yet. I still have some hair follicles yet It's all about moving forwards not back, sometimes to the detriment of our career, but that's the way we are. I sometimes feel I have spent my whole career pissing people like you off without meaning to.

Our sets have ALWAYS evolved slowly - since day one, and it's almost a feature. If you want to here the latest 20 releases then there are other artists who may serve you better. We pick music that we believe to be strong. You may not. That's fine. We're all different. We have always been like this - from the days of vinyl, listening to 50 records in a record shop only to buy 2. We hone things till we are happy with them.

I would argue we do play 80% or much more of what we sign, maybe you don't see the track list of every show either.... Not all of that tracks suit a crowd at a festival - that much is true. Equally we get away with playing quite a bit of what is widely considered fairly underground music at festivals, and I'm actually proud of that.

[philipandtigger]

And finally, pertinently with reference to Andrew Bayer...

17 December 2015 - 12:14 AM


D@Z, on 13 Dec 2015 - 11:47 AM, said:



I hate to admit it, but I have to agree with you here. When I listened to the preview I thought it sounded waaaay too much like Andrew Bayer. I've been saying for some time now that whilst I like Andrew Bayer working with Above & Beyond because I think he's an amazing producer, his sound is coming through too much on their recent output.



If someone showed me that preview to A.I. without telling me who it was or never hearing it before (live) I'd immediately think that was an Andrew Bayer track. It seems they've even used the little "WOO" bit in the track from Memories.

Jono:

How would you feel if it wasn't Andrew Bayer's "WOO"(!) from Memories, and if Andrew Bayer didn't put that bit in?



Rowan, on 14 Dec 2015 - 12:13 AM, said:



The drop is 100% Bayer, love the track, but apart from the breakdown there's little A & B. Same with Hello, and Peace of Mind.


Jono:

How would you feel if "the drop" bass moment wasn't originated by Bayer?



Some of the assertions that are stated almost as fact are quite amusing to me & Andrew. I don't generally correct matters but....

17 December 2015 - 01:38 AM


HighFlyer, on 16 Dec 2015 - 4:54 PM, said:



Personally, I think the above comments are silly, but why the defensive stance? I doubt these comments are written to offend, but are perhaps designed to provide constructive criticism - if we've been allowed to a dialogue, by having a forum, then we're talking about the good and the not so good (it never was tragically bad). I personally prefer classic A&B Sun & Moon, We Are All We Need sort of sound over the AI, Zero Gravity styled minimal drop sound, but I am not saying I hate the fact that Bayer made this or that (and I feel this is the case with above commenters, since I can somehow relate to them, but maybe they can't word it better? idk).



You seem to brush it off as negativity - hate on social media has been strongly crushed post-EDM era. It changed even around the trance environment, which I feel is seen by artists as some kind of a hater fort. I can't find actually anyone who says "A&B sold out" now; and any form of criticism towards you, Bayer, Anjunabeats etc. is received as badly as that. I still believe that over-positive fans make the environment as toxic as the haters, because there's no room for critique.



Yes, everyone can be a critic, and all that rubbish, but did you ever find a reviewer going "This album has no flaws" unless you truely believed it is perfect? I think we are potential reviewers of your product



Although DJ sets and individual releases are a different picture, I found that the below quote from another post to which you replied (in regards to DJ sets) perfectly sums up my point:

Jono:

Re-read what I wrote. I didn't brush it off as "negativity".



I am pointing out that it is mildly amusing to read these speculative things that are stated almost as fact, and am asking how it might change things (if at all) if it were not true.



Whether it be press, social media or forums - it's amazing how quickly things can seemingly become "fact".



Of course everyone is entitled to their opinion on any music - professional music critic, forum member or audience member. Bring it on! It doesn't mean I can't also reserve the right to laugh at some of the more far fetched things I read, just as anyone online has the right to write whatever they like about it.



We've never really tried to build a career out of making music in the studio based purely on feedback/constructive criticism outside our circle. There are other artists doing that very well indeed - much better than something I could ever be involved in. It's once we've got something we are happy with we then tend to share it with the world, and sometimes it sticks. Sometimes it doesn't. That's music. That's life. We'd probably make far more money and sell more records if we did it the other way.



Whether it be criticism or love (including "over positive fans" - though this is an odd concept I must say. It sounds like a pretty cynical label from a fellow Brit!), it's going to exist. I have to say though, you can't take away the joy that some might get from it. Joy from music whether we like the music or not is something to be celebrated.



Again, it's interesting that you refer to Sun & Moon as "classic" as to me that highlights how subjective one's reference can be. Also, it's my belief that there is room for sun & moon type tracks and more minimal sounds. It's part of an eclectic sound.

[theboz]

Damn you Tim. All that thread does is piss me off. I just hate how Jono would twist our words and give us these typical PR answers. Like when I asked him about why they don't play a better mix of new and old, he makes it seem like I want them to start digging through the dumpster fire that is the Beatport Top 10. No you chucklefuck, I just wanted to know why you guys don't play some of Anjuna's earlier 2.0 stuff like Isla Margarita, Capetown, Rebound, etc. But, in the words of Jono, "That's music. That's life."

[anthropology]

It's actually really easy to understand his point of view and incredibly reasonable/respectable the way they handle that aspect of their artistry; honestly Jono's reactions were quite restrained, take a step back and recognize the fact that they simply do not want to get stuck in a "nostalgic rut" that so many observers and critics insist they do - it's not our place to tell the artist how we feel he should tailor his sets or how he should do this or that, at the end of the day it's their choice. Considering the other end of the spectrum, Jono is sitting behind his computer reading mostly completely absurd commentary and assumptions on his life's work and craft.. give the man a break and let him have a "chuckle" at us plebs flinging chit when we clearly are.

Also there is no way Isla Margarita or Capetown would fit in their current sets... I do still fantasize about Rebound though, A+ track... BRING IT BACK!! BRING IT BACK INTO THE LIVE SETS!!!!!!!!

[mikeyfab]

i think most reasonable people that contributed to that thread never expected jono or A&B to change anything about their sets and their music based on what a forum says. that would be simply ridiculous. i understand the whole idea of the 'nostalgic rut' and how they don't want to get stuck in it, it's of course reasonable and respectable on the surface, but to be perfectly honest it just felt a bit insincere. recent A&B sets have seemed to only propagate the idea that anjuna is less about the creating club-friendly dance music with an emotional twist and more about the marketing machine & $$$$ these days, because it is filled with nothing but anjuna from the last ~1.5 years or so. they only want to push what's new and current so that their business model can succeed, which is why artists like jason ross and ilan bluestone have been rammed down our throats. that's business for you though, so i can't say i fault them, it's just unfortunate to see more emphasis placed on $ than the music.

when asked why not include some non-label tracks such as the ones which are featured on ABGT week and week out, he essentially replied 'we're too picky to play anything else'. i just wonder if he really believes that deep down in his heart (of hearts). either way, their sets have actually improved in terms of variation/freshness since that whole incident, so there's that at least.

but overall, trance shows bore me to absolute tears these days. i don't even bother seeing any anjuna artists when they come around in NYC, save for jaytech or super8 & tab, who i've heard play suru, black is the new yellow, irufushi, black is back, helsinki scorchin' and more, all in 2013 or later, and it worked in their sets with their newer material just fine.

house and (real) prog and techno gigs are the way to go for me these days. these genres actually leave room for djs to have great creativity and broad range of track selection in sets, whereas trance sort of keeps you pigeonholed. trance has become mostly a home listening genre for me (that is unless gabriel and dresden pop into town and decide to play a 6 hour classics set <3)